Fun with Twitter: Debating Liberals

As far back as I can remember, I’ve always found some joy in annoying smug people.  They can be easily found hanging around websites like the Daily Kos, MSNBC, Democratic Underground, Think Progress… seeing a pattern here?  I happened across a tweet made by MSNBC, you know the kind: propaganda geared towards riling up liberals against the wealthy, class warfare at its finest.

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Now, I’m not the kind of political junkie who can let something like this go.  I decided to respond which sparked a little discussion.

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I knew I was going to be asked for evidence of my claim, which to everyone except MSNBC viewers is common knowledge, so I had ready a source liberals would be reticent to dismiss, CNN.  Here’s what CNN had to say about this subject:

So Mitt Romney thinks his effective tax rate is about 15%.

That prompts many people to express disbelief: “What?! Most people pay a higher rate than that, don’t they?”

Actually, they don’t.

In fact, depending on how it’s measured, Romney’s effective tax rate is likely higher than what many, if not most, Americans pay.

Keep in mind, an effective tax rate is not the top income tax rate you pay. Those rates can run anywhere from 10% to 35%, depending on how high your income is.

By contrast, the effective rate generally is a measure of how much you pay in taxes as a percentage of your income.

[…]

If you consider income tax liability alone, the average effective federal tax rate for people with incomes between $40,000 and $50,000, for instance, is just 3.2%, according to Tax Policy Center estimates. (In measuring income, the center uses gross income and adds to it other forms of compensation, such as the money your employer contributes to your retirement savings.)

The lowest income families actually have negative average effective tax rates when income tax liability alone is measured.

For families making $50,000 to $75,000, the effective tax rate is 5.7%. From $75,000 to $100,000, it’s 7.2%. And if you make $200,000, it goes up to 9.9%.

[…]

A bevy of credits, deductions and exemptions that cancel out all or much of the income tax they would otherwise owe.

On the highest end of the income scale, the average effective tax rate is much higher — 18.9% for households making more than $1 million. But that’s still far below the 35% top tax rate much of their ordinary income would be subject to.

At the time, I was talking with a friend of mine online and I said, “you think they’ll try to dismiss CNN on this?”  He said, “Of course they will.”  I didn’t realize liberals hate the rich more than they love CNN, but he was right.

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At this point, if they’re willing to dismiss the left leaning CNN just to demonize the wealthy, all civil discourse is on the back burner.  If that weren’t bad enough, @AlphaEnder refutes CNN with… Paul Krugman, the NY Times Communist Economics contributor who recently advocated for a 91% income tax bracket to return.  After of course claiming the CNN article was debunked by a commenter to the article.  Riiight.

Knowing it was only a matter of time, @AlphaEnder inevitably responded like all liberals when backed into a corner surrounded by facts:

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@AlphaEnder wasn’t the only one who tried to debunk reality, @msgoddessrises tried her luck starting with the anti-Fox, anti-white male portion of the discussion.  Man, liberals really hate Fox, don’t they.

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After asking for proof that not raising taxes on billionaires helps create jobs, I responded with:

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Judging by all the Fox, GOP, and Reagan bashing she did throughout the entirety of the discussion, I think it’s safe to say her claim that she is a center, independent, pro-life, pro-gun, Christian, is probably false.  Many liberals tell themselves and others that they are down the middle and independent, but can’t think of a Republican they have ever supported or voted for, nor a Democrat they haven’t fawned over.  This is pretty much where it left off.  Some people you just can’t talk to.

Comments

  1. Looks like we had similar thoughts!

    http://ashokarao.com/2012/11/30/the-problem-with-percents/

    I’d consider myself liberal, in general, but this whole “he only paid 15%” is sort of funny.

  2. I find myself applying Proverbs 26:4 more and more to discussions with liberals and secular humanists (but I repeat myself). Liberals/secular humanists are fools in the sense that Solomon uses it. They are not necessarily mentally deficient, but morally deficient. They believe lies to shield their immorality. They believe the lie that the rich do not pay their fair share to hide their envy, or that a baby in the womb is not a human to protect their sexual behaviors from consequences. Government coerced taxation to pay for welfare programs are considered charity to them but allowing tax deductions for voluntary charitable donations to churches is a violation of the separation of Church and State.

    Facts do not matter to someone who would rather believe lies. That is why arguing with them is entirely pointless. They do not care about inconsistencies in their positions. They labor under a reprobate mind. They are in a spiritual blindness. Only an encounter with Jesus will cure them. I find myself more and more steering the conversation away from politics and more to introducing them to Jesus. In order to get our country back from the bankrupt and reprobate political philosophy of Obama and his supporters, Americans have to return to the reason for our country’s former greatness: Jesus Christ.

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